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M1001115 seasonal temperatures.

Greg Orme proposed the image M1001115 as possibly indicating a region of current fluid flows. Nick Hoffman argued these flows must be due to CO2 processes because of the temperature at the time of the image about -100 C. In the post copied below I suggested that at other times the temperatures may have exceeded 0 C, thereby permitting a liquid water origin for the flows.
Looking at the marsglobalsurveyor.com page for the image, I noticed the local time for the image was given as 1.35 in decimal hours, about 1:20 after midnight:

Sample pit surface in south polar region.
http://marsglobalsurveyor.com/PDS/ImgRecord.asp?ImageID=M1001115

The scene is rather confusing in that it's brightly lit, which would lead you to think it was taken during the daytime hours. However, at this latitude of -72 S the sun can be above the horizon continually for months during Spring and Summer, just as in arctic regions on Earth. I thought then that images of this region or of nearby regions might give higher temperatures in the range to allow liquid water if taken during daytime hours. Generally eventhough the Sun is above the horizon, the temperatures for the "nighttime" hours will be lower than for the daytime hours since the Sun is illuminating the scene from a very low angle with the sunlight actually coming over the pole to illuminate the region.
As I said in the prior post, TES measurements show temperatures can reach 0 C this far south at this time of the Martian year:

South Polar Cap Recession.
http://wwwflag.wr.usgs.gov/USGSFlag/Space/MGS_TES/spole99.html

And, the first infrared image of Mars from the THEMIS imager on Mars Odyssey confirmed 0 C could be reached at high southern latitudes:

First THEMIS Infrared and Visible Images of Mars.
http://mars.jpl.nasa.gov/gallery/polaricecaps/PIA03461.html

Also interesting is that a report by Edgett et.al. showed near 0 C could be reached in Richardson Crater at -72.4 S latitude:

Edgett, K.S., K.D. Supulver, and M.C. Malin, Spring defrosting of
martian polar regions: Mars Global Surveyor MOC and TES monitoring of
the Richardson Crater dune field, 1999-2000, The Second International
Conference on Mars Polar Science and Exploration, Abstract No. 4041,
Reykjavik, Iceland, August 2000
http://barsoom.msss.com/mars_images/moc/abs/polar2000/edgett_etal_dunes.pdf

"Synopsis: Changes in the appearance of a de-frosting
dune field in the martian southern hemisphere
are tracked from late winter into early summer.
Changes become noticeable shortly after the dune
field emerges into sunlight as winter transitions to
spring. These changes, in the form of small dark
spots formed on and along the base of the dunes, occur
while surface temperatures are still around the
freezing point of CO2 (~148 K). Most of the changes
occur over the course of spring, while temperatures
are transitioning from those of frozen CO2 toward the
H2O freezing point (~273 K)."

It concludes:

"The dunes in late winter are at temperatures consistent with frozen
CO2. Temperatures rise toward that of frozen H2O through-out the
spring, corresponding to the period in which the varied spots and
streaks are observed. By late spring, temperatures reach ~273 K and
all visual evidence for frost disappears except in early morning images such as
Fig. 1T, which has a corresponding albedo of 0.22 while the dune field
and substrate typically have an afternoon albedo of 0.14."

In Fig. 1S, it shows an image of defrosted dunes and gives a TES
temperature of 270 K. In Fig. 3, the paper plots the temperatures and
shows them reaching 273 K.

I found some nearby images to M1001115 using the "search for nearby images" function on the marsglobalsurveyor.com page:

Sample S-facing wall of south high latitude pit
http://marsglobalsurveyor.com/PDS/ImgRecord.asp?ImageID=M1300129

sample
http://marsglobalsurveyor.com/PDS/ImgRecord.asp?ImageID=M1001545

sample
http://marsglobalsurveyor.com/PDS/ImgRecord.asp?ImageID=M0903264

Sample south polar region pit and escarpments
http://marsglobalsurveyor.com/PDS/ImgRecord.asp?ImageID=M0902098
(this shows features similar to those of M1001115 suggestive of flows as well as dalmation spots.)

Cross large pit in south polar region
http://marsglobalsurveyor.com/PDS/ImgRecord.asp?ImageID=M0802293

Sample south polar region pit and escarpments
http://marsglobalsurveyor.com/PDS/ImgRecord.asp?ImageID=M0701685

scarps
http://marsglobalsurveyor.com/PDS/ImgRecord.asp?ImageID=M0402185
(also with similar features to M1001115 and dalmation spots.)

Perhaps someone will post the TES temperature readings of these areas to see if any of these nearby images to M1001115 approach 0 C in temperature.

Bob Clark

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Re: M1001115 season etc....
Posted by Robert Clark (147.31.4.2) on 2/11/2002 10:16:21 AM
In Reply to: Re: M1001115 season etc. [ Flame ON ! ] posted by Nick
Hoffman on 2/11/2002 4:42:28 AM

....
I take it your statement:
"There is no liquid water in this shot. TES average temperatures are
~170K (-100 C), although there is quite a range in this scene wth
the darker patches warmed by the sun to as much as ~200K (-70 C),
depending on exact direction of local slope, and the ice at ~147K
(-125 C)."
was meant to indicate the temperature at this location at this time.
Sorry I took it to mean the average over the entire year.
I thought the TES readings only gave an average temperature at a
resolution of 3km. Are you estimating the maximum temperature at
this site? I agree though an average temperature of -100C over a 3km
wide area makes it unlikely 0C is reached at some spot in that
region at this time.
The last image in the animation on the "South Polar Cap Recession"
page is at 251 degrees solar longitude. It appears to show large
portions of Mars at 70S latitude at around 0 degrees temperature:

South Polar Cap Recession
http://wwwflag.wr.usgs.gov/USGSFlag/Space/MGS_TES/spole99.html

I presume at 260 degrees solar longitude the temperature would be
warmer.
You can't tell specific sites from this animation however. But it
may be that at the site of image M1001115 at some time later on in
summer 0 degrees C is reached.
It seems to me unlikely that the gullies even if they occur
seasonally would disappear over only a year. So it may be that
channels seen in this image actually formed in earlier seasons when
0 degrees was reached.

Bob Clark
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http://habitablezone.com/space/messages/17890.html

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