Grondine wrote:

"Computer control programs were not developed earlier to deal with the re-entry of a tile damaged shuttle, nor were the pilot simulations set up for this.

You're not even on the same page."

Yes, thankfully were not on the same page! It would be terrible to be on the same page with you, Mr. Grondine.

Please, do tell. What possible 'dealing with' could be done on a tile damaged orbiter? Do you have ANY idea what you are talking about? ANY!?

Mr. Grondine also wrote:
"Crucial minutes were lost in which the pilot and commander could have adjusted Columbia's attitude and yaw."

The departure from 'norms' that lead to the shuttle breaking up was sudden. The computer program piloting the shuttle tried to compensate, but the Drag was larger than the possible compensating movements of the control surfaces. Even the directional thrusters were fired. The Astronauts could not have performed the maneuvers up to the specs the computer could. Your notion of the roles of the Pilot and the Commander is faulty and incorrect.

Grondine wrote
"You need to look up the concept of "frei punkt". The trauma induced by de-compression indicates the point at which the crew compartment failed."

This Makes no sense the context of your prior claims or our dialgue concerning them. If your claim is that the crew compartment somehow survived intact and slowed by the 16-17 mach numbers necessary before bailout WITHOUT rolling or tumbling so violently as to turn the crew into vanilla pudding, then all I can do is laugh at you some more.

The forces involved tore Titanium, composite and aluminum into thumb-sized shreds and larger chunks of ruin. Think of a modest size freight train. Then think of that freight train shooting an acetelyne flame-plume out the front. Now throw an astronaut in front of that with a parachute and a jump-suit. Does this click yet?

Mr Grondine goes on to make a larger idiot out of himself:
"G*d d*mn but you're confused. "Dogleg" refers to yaw."

The only POSSIBLE yaw involved in re-entry, otside that caused by unforseen events like the failure of the wing, is POSSIBLY to perform the 'S-turns' which (as previous posters have tried to inform you) are vital to thermal and kenetic management and have NOTHING TO DO AT ALL with international airspace considerations.

Mr Grondine, it seems that you fall into the category of people who believe that emphatically stating uninformed opinion (often with swear-words thrown in)makes them worth listening to or factually correct. I assure you, you are neither of those two. But it is fun to post against you in a fish-in-the-barrel sort of way.

I am not a Physicist or Aerospace Engineer, but I also am not illiterate or stupid or without the ability to think in a rigorous manner. What study of the shuttle situation/design I have performed makes me believe that you are even LESS informed than myself and LESS trained in Physics. It is said around here that you claim to be an expert in the field of 'impactors' or some such. I find this unlikely.

Best wishes,

Davin E. Lafon