Mark,

Whilst your comments about fuel requirement for the return journey from Mars to Earth are reasonable, they are not complete, IMHO.

The fuel requirement for escape from Phobos and return to Earth is quite modest, unlike the requirement for escape from the surface of Mars and return to Earth. In the latter case, locally-produced fuel would be ideal, and water ice would be the best source of both O and H for that fuel. So far, Zubrin is mostly right, but once we can exploit surface or subsurface ice on Mars, we don't need to import hydrogen & we don't need the complex chemical process to manufacture fuels from CO2. All we need is electrolysis, which just needs electric power - be it solar electric or nuclear electric (better for mass margin and total power output).

The big difference between a Phobos mission and a surface mission is that you need to develop a man-rated pin-point accurate re-entry system for Mars to arrive safely on the surface and land close to your refueling base. For Phobos, you simply dock your spacecraft with that moon, or go into close orbit around it. It is quite possible that the mass savings for launch from Earth for such a re-entry system would be equivalent to the fuel requirement for a return from Phobos, making a Phobos mission a valid test of the Earth-LMO (low Mars Orbit) -Earth phases of a full Earth-LMO-Surface-LMO-Earth mission.

There are other factors to consider, of course. if you went for a 1-month stay on Phobos, you would need a more fuel-expensive Hohman transfer orbit that launched 6 1/2 months before opposition and returned to Earth 6 1/2 months later, rather than a long-stay mission where you launched 3 months before opposition, landed 3 months after (like the current batch of missions), and returned to Earth with similar timing at the next opposition 22 months later.

Again, the fuel load for the longer flight MIGHT be traded off against the consumables for an 18-month stay on Mars. (Even if you make all your own water and oxygen in situ, you still need supplies of nitrogen, food, habitation, and equipment for a long-stay surface mission. You might want to run some numbers on this before blindly declaring your faith in the church of Zubrin. :-)

Like yourself, I am keen to see human explorers reach the surface of Mars and perform far more intelligent and flexible surveys of the geology, chemistry and even the possible biology of the planet. I am frustrated by the agonisingly slow progress of current robotic exploration (10 days to get off the ramp?!), but that is no reason to get angry about other people's comments.

If they don't understand your position, explain it slowly and carefully.

And while you're at it, think about their position, too. Some of what they say may have value.

As others have commented, if we cannot find a way to work together as a space interest community, we will never get to Mars or the asteroids, and perhaps never return to the Moon. If we squabble about what we should do first, we may end up doing nothing!