Well thanks Justin for posting a list of what you call real torture.
You must be ignoring the prisoners who are being humiliated, beaten and raped. But that doesn't qualify as torture to you, so we can just excuse it.

when the reports say 'beaten' I am thinking that could be no more that what soldeirs entering the Marine Corps are exposed to. This could be anything from a kick in the shin to to a pummelling to the ground with a basebal bat, and no one is being specific. From what I know and have seen form the medias reporting, if somehting really really bad was done they spell it out, unless there is an ambiguous term to use for it that could make people assume it was worse.

For example, they spelled out as many cases of 'abuse' that they could, because just saying abuse wasn;t bad enough. Some tried to sell it as torture, so that people will think of something worse, but most just say abuse and spell it out. to carry the allegations further. In the case of 'beatings' they are not spelling it out. I can assume pretty well that because they don't this means that its not going to sound as bad if they did, becasue they are probably just a kick in the shin, punch in the chest etc. . .

If I went to a Catholic school and a nun hit me with a ruler, is that "beatings and torture"?

I'm shocked that you're not shocked.
And your stance is inexcusable.

How about YOU get taken as a prisoner and we'll stand you on a small box, naked for hours (or days) with a hood on your head,

Standing around alot. . . sometimes naked. . . sounds like basic training and inprocessing.

. . .Except in basic training it was REALLY REALLY REALLY cold. That sucked, but I lived.


put electrodes on your hands, feet and genitals

I could adapt to the hood. . . and they are just going to attach them to me? how? will it hurt really really bad? Are they gonna use the tape that pulls out hair when they remove it? that could suck. ouch. I could adapt to that too though. . .

and tell you if you fall off you will be electrocuted?

hmmm. . . but not actually electrocuted. . . so you mean lied to right? yeagh I've been lied to by the army. . . damn recruiters. . .

I'd feel pretty damn fortunate if I were taken prisoner by any country that we would go to war with, and this was what happened to me.


How about we strip you naked, tie you by the hands and feet to the back of another "prisoner" and kick you both around? How about a lighted broomstick up your ass?

I'm glad my kids don't think like you. I raised them with a sense of decency and responsibility:


I'm not the one thinking up bondage fantasies with "lighted broomsticks". I don't see any reports about it, so it must be from your mind. . . a reflection of how you think.


>"Up to this point it is at about the point of college antics, though still wrong."


Anyway, you took my words out of context. The rape accusaiton and the beating accusations I am still waiting for futher info. Particularly I am most worried about the rape charge . . . rape and sodomy could encompass torture, but how you define them with regards to torture is pointles to me, because they are on a different level of wrong and inexcusable regardless.

I am also very concerned about that 'leash' photograph. . . the prisoner could have choked! Was it a choke safe leash? why was the prisoner on the ground? Was there a reason for the leash? . . . what the hell were these people thinking in the first place?

These are things I don't know, but i will wait for more info before I make up my mind just how wrong they were. . . though granted they probably were wrong, but innocent until proven guilty.