Flame — HabitableZone

Flame » in reply to No, it shouldn't, should it?

But it does

The first enhanced technique is excusable, the second and third can be forgiven, if not done to excess (which, of course, is impossible to quantify). The last three are torture.

Being a prisoner of war is never a pleasant experience, even if held by the most humane of captors. But the application of physical pain to coerce cooperation is simply unacceptable, Apply the Golden Rule on this one. If you woudn't want it to happen to you, or someone you love, it's torture. The fact that our enemies may do much worse to our men is a convenient misdirection. I know that if they treated our people exactly the way we treated theirs you would be outraged, and you'd have every right to be so. And from a purely practical point of view, we do not know these prisoners are torturers, or allied with them, or have any information which could lead to them. It is what we are trying to prove. And what information we do get will be always suspect.

John McCain is a hero because he resisted torture. When you start arguing about degrees and thresholds, you're nitpicking and self-serving.
As far as I can tell, the major criterion considered by the architects of this disgrace is whether or not it would leave any evidence. By this standard, rape (under medically supervised and hygienic conditions) would be an acceptable enhanced technique.

No one can predict how one would act when faced with these horrors, but I would like to think if I were a soldier and found an enemy doing 4,5, and 6 to my comrades, I might shoot them on the spot. But I would not do the same things to them.

If disciplined professional interrogators are allowed to employ these techniques, even in a manner strictly limited by guidelines, then it will give a green light and justification to the bullies and sadists which can be found in any army. That's what Abu Gharaib was all about.

I don't presume I am so noble and decent that if placed in these battlefield conditions I wouldn't be tempted myself to carry out similar atrocities on what I considered subhuman monsters, in order to extract
information that might save the lives of my comrades. But for sleazy Washington bureaucrats and lawyers to to cavalierly make these decisions, often against the military's own guidelines (which are based on how it want's ITS people treated if captured) is a crime for which history will judge us harshly. Indeed, it already has.

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