Hi Tony,

Three strikes.....
1. Ignore the matter of the first post and sidestep to a new topic.

Not really. The subject was wife beating. I took the topic to its natural core - abuse of women. You said it was acceptable to beat your wife in the US in 1960 and implied that 1960 America was comparable in views to some muslim practices today, which I felt was preposterous on the face of it.

Sure, you can go to slums and poorer rural regions and find a number of wife beaters - and husband beaters, but the practice was never accepted or condoned in the 60's, 50s, 40s...heck, ever. The Judeo-Christian underpinnings to the US have always ostracized wife-beaters as sinners, deviants and sociopaths.

2. Ask questions then ignore answers.

Well your links looked more like an indictment of the UK & Europe - I almost felt I didn't need to add anything. ;-)

Besides that's a trait of those who ride "high horses."


3. Sidestep to another topic.



Oh, I cant judge you out, you tried so hard.
(Patronizing style copyright infringement. So sorry.)



How come so few appreciate facetious sarcasm posing as patronization? Everyone is so uptight! I mean, does anyone really think I look down on folks here and judge them? My smiley faces are chock-full of good sentiment and good humour.*

Let's start off with the most flagrant abuses:
500,000 women and children are slaves in western europe.
If this projection by HRWF is true, it means that more women are slaves in western europe than in any democratic nation on earth.



If this projection is true, that is horrifying. But in case you hadn't noticed western europe is not a single nation. Out of 4 million trafficked worldwide, one eighth go to Western Europe.



Yes, to be brutally honest we know the majority probably end up in Netherlands, Belgium, France, Norway - with the UK and Germany trailing behind a bit... right chap? (wink)


The sex-slave trade of women in the EU is a peculiar throwback to barbaric times which any EU woman should be deeply affronted by, yet which goes on much as the legalized prostitution and other morally weak EU positions.



the slave trade should affront everybody. Your political statement has no proof. Yet you continually do this - throw figures around and then project your ideology on them without substantiation.



Do I? I may not post quite as many supportive links per posts as Tom...but I try to pull authoritative figures without pulling them out of thin air.

Here's one on EU vs US drug policy

This one shows how 50% of women in India think wife-beating is justified. I suppose you think that is a comparable view to the US in 1960?

This one shows how wife-beating is an epidemic in Spain

This one was designed to convince muslim wife-beaters that the Quran doesn't support their actions.

This one talks more about the Quran and how many believe it does support wife beating


In the UK drug dealers now regularly are also into the SLAVE trade - a phenomenon completely absent from America. This would never be tolerated in America not now - and not in 1960. You'd have to go back to 1860 to find anything resembling it.



If you believe that no pimp in the US is also into prostitution, then blah blah Brooklyn Bridge blah blah.
Likewise against-the-will prostitution.


In Europe African slavery still exists!
Truly horrific. And note from the same link a quote you may not have got to - "The US State Department estimates that some 50 000 women and children are brought to the United States to be forced into prostitution, bonded sweetshop (sic) labour and domestic servitude."
Better than Europe, but enough to give yer high horse the hiccups.

Can you imagine the HORROR if such a thing were discovered to be occurring in the US?
Oh, you didn't read that far, did you?



Yer, right - I confess I stopped short of that last paragraph.


I've even tried to find US statistics and this was as close as I could find: This report projects 45-50,000 women and girls are trafficked into the whole of the US while western europe alone accounts for 500,000. That's quite a disparity!



So the same as you completely dismissed above. Yes it is quite a disparity. A shocking disparity.


As for the knife crimes,they are all over europe and rising at epidemic proportions.

For proof of which you offer one article from Poland?



You know this is interesting. I did a search for knife crimes in europe and it is very hard to find anyone talking about it. It is almost as if there exists a concerted effort to ignore the knife-related violence. Perhaps an EU whitewashing of the matter to avoid confronting the real truth - that generally most knife crimes are perpetrated by young foreigners?

If they talked about knife violence too much - they might have to come to a conclusion that their liberal immigration policy was making city life a hellworld for the natives.


Heck, my own German grandmother and 2 cousins have been mugged by knife wielding criminals. This shocked me - but they act as if it is almost the normal cost of living in europe and were relatively blasé about it - because it happens so often.



I'm sorry for your relatives. But I still don't see it. You don't think that many US city dwellers count gun-point muggings as a cost of living in the city? Many of my US friends used to, or still do, carry around mugging money or a fake wallet - you throw that at the guy and run away, your main wad and cards safely with you.

Did you even look at any of the links I posted?
Or the stats I posted?
Do any of the statistics you posted above support your original contention that women are much more vulnerable in Britain or Europe than in the US? In one sense yes - for women trafficked in.

Is your horse so friggin' high that you can't see the real world anymore?

Cheers,
Tony



Hopefully, these new links do more to support my position. Unfortunately there is a lot of debate regarding the statistics and naturally no nation wants to come off as being ineffective against rising crime. This makes statistical analysis so difficult. The British Home Office papers are so buried in rhetoric and discussion it's hard to pull useful statistics from them. I perused them for twenty minutes for wife-beating or domestic violence statistics before throwing up my hands.

"Maybe Tom can wade through it - he'll wade through anything." (Said in tone to match the 'Hey Mikey...he likes it!' cereal commercial)

I would love for you to defend your assertion that the 1960's US beliefs or lifestyle directly or obliquely supported wife-beating.

Do you really believe that or were you just taking a pot-shot at Phil to counter his "Islam is Love" series?

Best regards,

SDAI-Tech1

*(Included the u for your benefit;-)