Hum, canvas pants, canvas jackets and cowboy boots...riding around on rubber tires in "Grover"....

Ep wrote hastily: In an earlier post, our Mr. Vance compared the Mars Nuts latest pr stunt to Apollo training exercises. As from this it appears evident our Mr Vance has difficulty here, it is time to explain to him the differences between training exercises and playing Mars.

Chris writes: EP here is referencing...this post. Building a strawman, EP?

EP wrote: The Apollo astronauts were actually going to the Moon. The Mars Nuts will not be going to Mars.

Chris writes:If you truly believe that you would no longer have a reason to post. At some point people are going to Mars and the science we do in our canvas suits will be used.

EP wrote: The Apollo astronauts were training to do science after arriving on the Moon. The Mars Nuts are not only pretending that they really are doing science, they are also pretending that they are training for manned Mars flight. Since no manned Mars flight will happen anytime soon, it is simply impossible that they are training for it.

Chris writes: No, they were learning geology from Gene Shoemaker because they were jet pilots not geologist. Many of the people you call "Mars Nuts" are Ph.Ds and Geologists...are you? Interesting logic, EP. The big problem with your logic is we are working on Human Factors not training people to go to Mars...yet. This of coarse explains your not grokking the canvas suits and plastic helmets thing...even though I have tried to tell you this before...

EP wrote: The Apollo training space suits bore some resemblance to the real thing. The Mars Nuts' sutis are made of canvas and dust bin parts, and bear no resemblance to any possible real Mars suit.

Chris writes: See above image... It depends on what the task is what materials are used. The canvas suits and helmets isolate a person from the environment and the helmets are in fact a very good analog in how they restrict vision... I would contend you don't have expertise in knowing what a real Mars suit would look like. I've studied this for years I think I do have some small expertise here... Besides it isn't about the look of it. It's about the feel form inside of it. I've put on the MDRS Suit before have you?

In a year or two when we're use fiberglass helmets backplanes and more layers to the suits thus increasing fidelity to an actual Mars Suit (if they are pressure suits)...will they care as much then...folks? Why are they so threatened by costumed players if that is what we are? Why is it that when I mention peer review papers put out by TMS and members of the MDRS and FMARS crews they don't address any of them...attack them?

---Chris Vancil