This is a common trick when I'm arguing economics, employment, and other issues. It's why suddenly the unemployment rate is ignored by liberals in favor of more exotic methods of figuring employment, although these methods were never used before. And I'm the one "playing with statistics?"
I know what I mean when I say "profit," and so does everyone else. Money in, and money out, and profit is what's left over. It's what people compare when discussing one industry versus another, and if you want to talk dishonesty with numbers, how about the original premise that the raw size of the profit is what counts, and not the percentage of sales or operating costs?
If you want to shift the argument over to Return on Capital Employed (a term I wonder if you had ever heard of until you found it on a web site bitching about the oil companies), then we need to establish that somehow 31 percent is an outrageous number. Of course, you're counting on the idiots reading that two-digit number and confusing it back into "profits" again, aren't you?
Some ROCE numbers from 2003, from some sample companies in various industries:
Oil industry average was 28 percent, in 2003.
Software industry average: Microsoft, 22 percent. Oracle, 42 percent.
Trucking industry average: 23 percent
The homebuilding industries range from -1 to 97 percent, with an average of 18.
Household products average 27.1 percent, with Colgate Palmolive at 54, and Clorox at 37, and Procter and Gamble at 26.
Medical devices average 18 percent. Varian and Stryker are both about 32.
Newspapers? NYT and Knight Ridder are at about 23 percent. Dow Jones runs at 169.2 percent(!) Average for that industry is 18 percent.
Specialty retailer average, 22 percents. Autozone, 48. Bed Bath and Beyond, 32.
Pharmaceutical? Average 22 percent. Merck is at 34. Johnson and Johnson, 32.
Restaurants? Average, 19 percent. Dennys, 43. Papa Johns, 45. Outback Steakhouse, 36.
Broadcasters, film, TV? Stinking up the joint with an average of 6 percent, with Fox Entertainment topping the list at 13.
Computers average about 12 percent. Dell is at 52. Apple? 0.6.
Drug retailers average at 21 percent. Walgreens, 26.
Food industry average, about 16 percent. Campbells, 28. Wrigley, 36. H. J. Heinz, 23.
Aerospace and Defense, average is 12 percent. Boeing, 8. Northrup, 7. Go figure.
Apparel retailers average, 23 percent. Gap, 30. Ross, 46. Abercrombie and Fitch, 38.
Source here.
So, while the oil companies are certainly above average in this particular statistic (average being about 15 percent for all industries), the examples I've shown show they are hardly freaks in this category.
Incidentally, in investing, an ROCE of 18 percent is considered a minimum for a good investment in a capital-heavy industry.
You also overlooked that they paid almost three times in taxes than net earnings, never mind the taxes that come out at the pump.
Current Events » in reply to You know how I feel about this sort of thing
Changing the rules in the middle of the game.
The whole thread (25 posts)
- EXXON makes Record 10 BILLION Dollars this past quarter Price Gouging Us and the President Doesn't Stop It
- Sorry, it's Business
- About a 9.5 percent profit.
- Gee And It's Not Because Of Cheap Oil
- Answer is............ NOT ENOUGH PRODUCT!!!!!
- re: EXXON makes Record 10 BILLION Dollars this past quarter Price Gouging Us and the President Doesn't Stop It
