Raoul, have you ever wondered why the people of the Middle East that find themself opposed to Israel and super powers (USA) have refused to even try the methods of Ghandi and MLK, when history has proven that this is the shortest route to victory against overwhelming odds. They are obviously willing to sacrifice their lives so why not risk them in passive resistance for a change.

I have to wonder if they are enough like us and is their thought process similar enough to allow persuasion. Is it possible that they (they being the leaders that seem to dictate strategy) simply want us all dead.

I am not ready to say that persuasion won't work but I confess that I am discouraged.

Suppose that you were determined to persuade an individual and on every occasion that you failed to convince him to move an increment in your direction he took a finger or a toe. Is there any point short of starting to lose an arm or leg that you would decide that he simply does not intend to be persuaded. There are good men in the world that would finally lose their own head before saying no more. I assume that you are not one of those good men.

What I would like to see is more serious, condition red dialogue on our side (western civilization) as to now many body parts we will be willing to give up. If we can't persuade each other we will never persuade them. There has to be a finite line somewhere that our side can agree on before we can expect to convince them of anything.

IMHO if western civilization does not come to agreement and present a united front, millions, probably billions will die in the next fifty or so years.