I wrote awhile back: "If you support Mars Society members work like the Phoenix Landed and MECA and think it's good science. Then why do you pick on us as non scientists or as living in a fantasy?"

Exactly where is the word sponsored in the above, Barry?

And you are wrong! All of the people I'm thinking of profess membership in the Mars Society at the drop of a hat. I've talked to them, know them better than you and think it is safe to say they are happily dues paying members in good standing in TMS. Anyway, I'm a citizen of the US of A and pay taxes so are many of the TMS members so we do sponsor the Phoenix Lander with our tax money, go fish!

As to you picking on me...go read the above again. I say us. That 'us' includes many scientists and engineers with degrees including many with Ph.D.s and three members of TMS steering committee who also happen to be members of the Phoenix Landed team...one of which is the Principal Investigator of the Lander!!!

Barry wrote: Alos, if ICAMSR set up a mock sample receiving laboratory analogous to your Utah and Arctic stations and its members doned canvas and duct tape level 4 biohazard suits, what would you think? Would you think ICAMSR was doing "serious research"?

Chris writes: Hum, you frankly are so clueless I don't know where to begin. First, why not just go buy Hazmat suits? They exist at a reasonable price. Second, spacesuits like we would need don't exist and if they did would be tens of millions of dollars each (btw an evolved spacesuit is one of the analog projects). We are doing human factors engineering at the HABs. We only need something that approximates some of the features of a real spacesuit right now. The canvas could just as well be Dacron or Gore-Tex or Vectran. Non of which you know from each other so why does it matter to you? The duct tape is used to hold things on the suits and will be replaced with pockets, Velcro straps and built in electronics eventually. You seem not to get this and seem to be stuck in some retarded funk.

If I were you I would seriously think about doing the ICAMSR setup you suggest. But, first you need to ask yourself why this model and what human factors engineering would be worthwhile doing at your ICAMSR analog? Can you sustain at least several years of research and would any of it be valid? Who would use the facility and how would you fund it?

I wouldn't use duct tape or canvas suits even if they cost the least amount, because some fool will mistake this as some sort of foolishness and be picking on you for it even after you stop using them.