I've noticed on some other boards that a good sign I've made my point is when the argument degenerates into "how could you POSSIBLY say something so idiotic?"

The presidents you listed manifested themselves in an unbending hostility toward communism and the expansion of the Soviet Union, a conviction that the U.S. was the best country in the world, and a dedication to the support of democracy and freedom wherever possible.

This kind of thinking is noticably rarer in the modern Democratic leadership.

If Jimmy Carter and Walter Mondale had presided over the 1980s, the U.S.S.R. would probably still be there, and running most of Central America.

John Kerry lost the election primarily because there was nothing he could do, after his long post-Vietnam history of hostility toward the military, to dress himself up as someone who would support the military in a time of war.

Mary Anne makes a good point that if we discuss domestic policy, things get a bit fuzzier, but my original point about taking sides against our own country wasn't intended to apply to domestic policy.