Just maybe, if people would use the various forums the way they were designed, we'd have a much more civil interaction.

It's when guys like Tom jump into the legitimate discussion forums like CE and Off Topic without any attempt at brainstorming and fair debating but instead with "gotcha" blasts that the tempers flare and people feel blindsided.

Go back through history and see how many times Tom and others like Techie start things on CE knowing full well their intent is flaming the other side. Just because he throws in some subtlety and some link to governmental charts and graphs doesn't make it any less insidious. It's what follows next if someone is boneheaded enough to follow the links and comment on them or on their little throwaway lines that go along with them that question the reader's intelligence, patriotism, or courage.

How stupid are we to put up with the idiotic and just plain malicious and blatantly false editorializing of these guys that would be dumped in a heartbeat from legitimate blog sites for troll-like behavior? It has nothing to do with their stance, only their style. This is the forum for breaches in that style not CE. It's no wonder this place attracts the outrageous like Lee and Arrell.

Look at where this discussion went. Tom stated, as if fact, that the administration was not guilty of lying us into war or of any prosecutable crimes simply because no binding legal action had been taken against them and yet everyone knows that the traditional paths to that prosecution have been blocked and impeded by a Republican Party that circled the wagons and embraced a unitary executive style of government. There was nothing hidden about that. They were blatant about consolidating power. With the exception of one or two rogue Republicans like Ron Paul, the entire Republican congressional delegation voted as a unit every time without exception. The President publicly announced he would veto any bill that had even a hint of liberalism or compromise and there was never a question of override based on numbers. Executive and judicial appointments during this administration were unquestionably the most partisan and incompetent of any in our lifetime and at no time could there have been any chance of blocking them given the numbers.

It shouldn't have taken Bowser, Lindy, or I to call him on this bullshit. It should have rained down on him by all participants on all sides of the aisle. But no. Instead you just go on like sheep and wear your "I'm with Stupid" t-shirts.

Steve, don't worry about my exclusion from this pub. There are still plenty out there where people still have a spine and some sense of integrity.

Art